Hot!Programming the PIC device

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john0bravo
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2018/11/08 11:15:23 (permalink)
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Programming the PIC device

Hi, 
 
I am very new to the MPLAB software. I normally use MPLAB X IDE software to compile the code, it also generate hex file if I build the project. I guess MPLAB compilers xc8, xc16, and xc32 are already added in MPLAB X IDE. Is that right ? I also see that there is MPLAB IPE in installation, what this software is doing ? 
 
When I explore programming the PIC device than I found that there are two programmers.  
1- MPLAB PM3 Universal Device Programmer
2- PICkit™ 3 Programmer/Debugger
 
The second one is cheaper while the first one is expansive. Technically what is the difference between the two in terms of programming ? With second one it is necessary to have AC164110 ? 
#1

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    vloki
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 11:49:20 (permalink)
    4 (1)
    PICkit is not specified as a "production" programmer.
     
    It is usually used for development. Most time as a in-circuit-debugger.
    (or the interface to the PIC build in debugger)
    You can use it as a programmer too.
     
    You generally do not need a AC164110 to use a PICkit.
    A 6 (5) way 100mil pin header at your target board will do the job. (like in the picture there)
    post edited by vloki - 2018/11/08 12:07:35

    Uffbasse !
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    NKurzman
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 11:57:21 (permalink)
    4 (1)
    I found that there are two programmers.
    1- MPLAB PM3 Universal Device Programmer
    2- PICkit™ 3 Programmer/Debugger
    3- ICD3
    4-ICD4
    5-PICkit4
    6-Snap
    7-Real-Ice
    8-3rd Party programmers.

    Just 2?
    The PM3 is a stand-alone production programmer. Most of the rest require a PC.

    No the compilers must be installed separately.

    IPE is just for programming not code development.
    #3
    qhb
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 11:59:31 (permalink)
    4 (1)
    john0bravo
    ...
    I guess MPLAB compilers xc8, xc16, and xc32 are already added in MPLAB X IDE. Is that right ?

    You did not reveal what device you have been compiling for. THAT compiler (XC8, XC16 or XC32) must be installed.
    You must have installed it, they don't come with MPLABX.
     
     

    I also see that there is MPLAB IPE in installation, what this software is doing ?

    That is the "Integrated Programming Environment".
    It is standalone software that lets you program chips without firing up the full IDE.
     

    When I explore programming the PIC device than I found that there are two programmers.  
    1- MPLAB PM3 Universal Device Programmer
    2- PICkit™ 3 Programmer/Debugger

    Do you mean you have those two?
    There are many available from Microchip right now.
    Snap, PICkit3, PICkit4, ICD3, ICD4, RealIce, PM3.
     
    The PM3 is a very old, very expensive standalone programmer intended for production programming. It cannot do debugging.
    All the others can do debugging. All the others act as peripherals to a PC.
    (Although the PICkit devices are able to program some devices in a stand alone "Programmer to Go" mode)
     

    With second one it is necessary to have AC164110 ?

    The AC164110 is an "RJ11 to ICSP" adaptor.
    It depends what sort of conenctor you have on your target board for programming.
    The PICkits have an ICSP connector already.
    The ICD and Real Ice have an RJ11 connector.
     
    #4
    john0bravo
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 12:42:32 (permalink)
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    I guess the cheaper Programmer and Debugger is PICkit4 ? and others are expansive, right ?. Also what is the difference between PICkit3 and PICkit4 ? 
     
    ICD3 or ICD4 are also Programmers and Debuggers but the price is four times higher then PICkit3 or PICkit4, what is the main difference between them technically ? Any recommendation ? 
     
     
    post edited by john0bravo - 2018/11/08 12:51:00
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    vloki
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 13:01:19 (permalink)
    5 (1)
    For me, I would buy  a PICkit4.
    But ...  to give recommendation we need to know YOUR requirements ;-)
     

    Uffbasse !
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    john0bravo
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 13:09:21 (permalink)
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    The basic requirement is Programming and Debugging. I guess ICD4 and PICkit4 are simply new versions of ICD3 and PICkit3, right ? I am still confused if both ICD and PICkit3 are Programmers and Debuggers then how the price difference is a factor of four ? Do ICD have more debugging features compared with PICkit ? I guess both have ICSP interface. 
    post edited by john0bravo - 2018/11/08 13:10:23
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    vloki
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 14:10:28 (permalink)
    5 (1)
    Programming/debugging  one PIC/project a day, week, month ....?
    Which PIC? 100, 1000,10000 lines of code?

    Uffbasse !
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    qhb
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 15:01:07 (permalink)
    5 (1)
    All these devices (apart from PM3) are programmers AND debuggers.
    The ICD has a faster USB interface than the PK, so can program large PICs quicker than the cheaper device.
    It also has more robust drivers on the ICSP interface, so is more suitable for mass programming.
    The actual features offered depend upon what PIC you are debugging. There is a complete table listing debug features by PIC device and programmer at:
    http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/HWToolDebugFeatures.pdf
     
     
     
    #9
    katela
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 15:57:28 (permalink)
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    john0bravo
    I guess the cheaper Programmer and Debugger is PICkit4 ? and others are expansive, right ?. Also what is the difference between PICkit3 and PICkit4 ? 
     

    It's all depend on your requirements and the size of your pocket. The cheapest is Snap. It's also an In-Circuit Debugger/Programmer for most PIC®, dsPIC® and AVR flash MCUs. It cost only $14.95
    PICKit4 is newer version of PICKit3.
    The price is the same, so it's logical to buy the newer version.
     

    Free online Microcontroller Tutorials and Projects for Hobbyists and students. From beginners to advanced. Website: www.studentcompanion.co.za
    YouTube Tutorials: https://www.youtube.com/user/StudentCompanionSA
    #10
    qhb
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 16:00:56 (permalink)
    5 (4)
    katela
    ...
    PICKit4 is newer version of PICKit3.
    The price is the same, so it's logical to buy the newer version.

    Except if you're in a hurry. The PK4 does not yet support all the devices that PK3 does...
     
     
    #11
    NorthGuy
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 16:32:44 (permalink)
    5 (2)
    NKurzman
    Just 2?
    The PM3 is a stand-alone production programmer. Most of the rest require a PC.


    It's only one. For the price of PM3 you can buy a laptop and use it with any other programmer :)
     
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    NKurzman
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 16:41:30 (permalink)
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    NorthGuy
    NKurzman
    Just 2?
    The PM3 is a stand-alone production programmer. Most of the rest require a PC.


    It's only one. For the price of PM3 you can buy a laptop and use it with any other programmer :)



     
    True, but, it is what many want for production.  It really should be a PM4 by now.  It was hard to get compatible SD cards 3 years ago.
    #13
    NorthGuy
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 16:54:54 (permalink)
    5 (2)
    NKurzman
    True, but, it is what many want for production.  It really should be a PM4 by now.  It was hard to get compatible SD cards 3 years ago.



    True. Some people always want to buy the most expensive thing on the market. I'm not one of them and therefore I can't understand their reasons.
     
    Laptop is certainly better value - much better user interface, you can run test scripts to test your board along with programming. You can also use it with USB scopes and logic analyzers.
    #14
    NKurzman
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/08 21:21:07 (permalink)
    5 (1)
    For production quick easy and minimal training can override a few hundred dollars savings. It all depended on the production line and how “needy” it is.
    It is the right tool for some jobs.
    But the high price says it is low volume.
    #15
    john0bravo
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/09 01:43:56 (permalink)
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    I don't understand why PICKIT4 supports less number of devices compared to PICKIT 3. I would mostly work with 8 bit and 16 bit PIC devices. Do they both support 8 bit and 16 bit PIC devices ?. How about IC3 and IDC 4 ? Do they support same number of Devices or not ? 
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    qhb
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/09 03:03:07 (permalink)
    5 (2)
    john0bravo
    I don't understand why PICKIT4 supports less number of devices compared to PICKIT 3.

    The key qualifier was "yet".
    The PK4 is brand new, and plainly different internally to the old PK3. Microchip are still slowly adding support for all devices to the PK4. You would need to check if it already supports the devices YOU are interested in.
    I don't know about the ICD4, but the situation may be similar.
     
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    john0bravo
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/09 15:00:55 (permalink)
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    Thanks for participating in discussion. It is not so easy to decide which Programmer to buy. I would mostly work with 8 bit and 16 bit PIC devices. I guess it is Ok to buy PICKIT3 or PICKIT 4 which are relatively cheaper compared to ICD 3 and ICD 4 but on the other hand if Snap is also a Programmer and Debugger then why not Snap to buy. 
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    qhb
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/09 15:08:00 (permalink)
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    Again, double check if SNAP can do the devices you are interested in.
    SNAP can only do low voltage programming, which may or may not restrict you.
     
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    katela
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    Re: Programming the PIC device 2018/11/09 15:17:44 (permalink)
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    Only you can make that decision after considering all your requirements and the size of your pocket.

    Free online Microcontroller Tutorials and Projects for Hobbyists and students. From beginners to advanced. Website: www.studentcompanion.co.za
    YouTube Tutorials: https://www.youtube.com/user/StudentCompanionSA
    #20
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